View Full Version : Ralliart Suspension Upgrade
NFSLancerRA
08-15-2011, 11:53 AM
So, here goes: My next big undertaking for the Ralliart will be a new set of Shocks and Struts. I have decided to go with Koni adjustable dampeners, as the guys at Koni have agreed to develop a set of components for the Ralliart. This is not going to be a simple re-valve hack-job. The internal components of the stock pieces are going to be completely removed and everything is going to be redesigned.
I have no clue what the price is going to be for this upgrade, yet. It will be competitive, though. I will keep this thread updated over the coming weeks as progress is made. I hope to dial-in this upgrade as much as possible to create the ultimate suspension package. It sucks that no-one makes aftermarket shocks and struts for this car. That is about to change.
BravoZero
08-15-2011, 11:57 AM
+1,000,000!
That is awesome, great news. Thank you for taking on this project.
NFSLancerRA
08-15-2011, 12:10 PM
Not a problem. Someone had to do it. I have been on the phone for the past week with suspension companies. Bilstein was a no-go. KYB said no way. Koni said, "sure, send us over a set of components, and we should have something for you soon. (with an Australian accent, so you know it will be good)"
GAbOS
08-15-2011, 12:56 PM
sweet!!! .
RG-RA
08-15-2011, 04:39 PM
so never messed with suspension before so what is going to be the difference with oem vs new koni vs coilovers. just wondering what price is going to be about? and will these work better with aftermarket springs and why? if this might have been explained somewhere else before please just point me in the right direction, i did search briefly but didnt turn up what i was looking for.
and thanks NFSlancerRA for taking on all these projects for us:D
NFSLancerRA
08-15-2011, 04:50 PM
so never messed with suspension before so what is going to be the difference with oem vs new koni vs coilovers. just wondering what price is going to be about? and will these work better with aftermarket springs and why? if this might have been explained somewhere else before please just point me in the right direction, i did search briefly but didnt turn up what i was looking for.
and thanks NFSlancerRA for taking on all these projects for us:D
These are going to be very beefy components. They should be cheaper than most coilovers and much higher quality.
Scarab23
08-15-2011, 04:51 PM
did they give you any time frame for these to be done? I'm in the market for coils and id be very interested In these.
NFSLancerRA
08-15-2011, 06:18 PM
did they give you any time frame for these to be done? I'm in the market for coils and id be very interested In these.
The time frame is expected to be around 1 and 1/2 months. I will send off a set of blown components as soon as I find a set. The guy who agreed to give me his hasn't gotten back to me yet. Once that is done, it will be about 3-4 days to get it to Koni. They should have the components for between 2 and 3 weeks. After that, they will send me my completed set. I will run them for a couple of weeks and get them out after everything has been thoroughly tested. I do trust these guys, though, so I expect everything to be right.
BravoZero
08-15-2011, 06:31 PM
What springs will you be using for testing?
NFSLancerRA
08-15-2011, 06:37 PM
What springs will you be using for testing?
RRM G.R.I.P.
If I can get my hands on a set of WORKS springs by the end of next month, I will be using those instead.
GAbOS
08-15-2011, 11:35 PM
Not testing these on stock springs?!
I'll buy the full monte for a non-static ride height; and compression; and camber..
It would be slick to see a strut redux for the ralliart at the SCCA Stock level. Getting tired of the Mazda's. :)
NFSLancerRA
08-16-2011, 07:29 AM
Not testing these on stock springs?!
I want something stiffer than that.
I thought you was going adopt the active shocks.
I got too much on my project list to do..
I figured Suspension would be one of the last thing because cost.
I dont like stiff suspension as it is only good for flat roads.
Im tired today... zzzzZZZZZ...
NFSLancerRA
08-16-2011, 11:07 AM
I thought you was going adopt the active shocks.
These are going to be much more cost effective.
So shocks & springs? Any adjust-ability? :)
NFSLancerRA
08-16-2011, 12:02 PM
So shocks & springs? Any adjust-ability? :)
Of course. These will be the real deal Koni adjustables.
Sounds good! :cool:
If only we can get everybody that prototype & produce parts on the same page to make parts for the RA. :cool:
Keep up the vision & creativity. :)
NFSLancerRA
08-16-2011, 05:43 PM
I only make these things, because no one else seems to think that there is a point. I want these shocks, and that is enough motivation to at least make myself happy. If I can do the same for others, everybody wins.
BravoZero
08-16-2011, 06:17 PM
Dude if you could get these produced successfully and they're at a reasonable price... I'll sell my coilovers for these!
NFSLancerRA
08-16-2011, 10:04 PM
Dude if you could get these produced successfully and they're at a reasonable price... I'll sell my coilovers for these!
If you still have your stock suspension, I am interested in one front and one rear dampener. I was planning to buy them from someone locally, but he decided to keep them. Send me a PM if you are interested. I will throw you $100 for the components and pay for shipping. :D
They will be returned to you...eventually.
NFSLancerRA
08-16-2011, 10:06 PM
The sad thing is that I won't be making any money on this upgrade. The final product will be sold directly through Koni. I am willing to pay for the R&D, though. It needs to be done.
BravoZero
08-17-2011, 05:19 AM
If you still have your stock suspension, I am interested in one front and one rear dampener. I was planning to buy them from someone locally, but he decided to keep them. Send me a PM if you are interested. I will throw you $100 for the components and pay for shipping. :D
They will be returned to you...eventually.
PM inbound.
TheBlackBeast
08-17-2011, 01:54 PM
Sweet!!! Finally there will be a decent option. I'll be saving up for this then as I'm getting a little tired of bottoming out on the bump stops...
NFSLancerRA
08-17-2011, 02:49 PM
PM inbound.
Replied. Let me know when the components are on the way, and I will ready the spec-sheet to send to Koni. :D
NFSLancerRA
08-17-2011, 02:51 PM
Sweet!!! Finally there will be a decent option. I'll be saving up for this then as I'm getting a little tired of bottoming out on the bump stops...
Yeah, not having an option is totally insane. This needed to be done.
vastair
08-18-2011, 02:37 PM
koni yellows were the first thing i looked for prior to bying my ra sb...
i would like to run them with ground control set up but i dont think they are available either.... for the money i always found that as the best combo for performance and adjustability...! way to get things going...!
NFSLancerRA
08-18-2011, 02:50 PM
koni yellows were the first thing i looked for prior to bying my ra sb...
These with Eibach Pro-Kit springs should be a pretty damn-decent setup.
vastair
08-18-2011, 03:42 PM
i agree...but ground-controls use eibach springs...so therefor u can adjust damping n ride height.plus u can buy different springs for the set up ur using if u need 2 use a higher or lower spring rate...imo i just think its always better to have more adjusting options... for most people koni yellows wit eibach springs should be sufficient though...
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.weaksauceparts.com/store/images/t_17380_01.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.weaksauceparts.com/store/product.php%3Fproductid%3D17380&h=176&w=316&sz=47&tbnid=EamMe2wjZfeVBM:&tbnh=65&tbnw=117&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dkoni%2Byellow%2Bground%2Bcontrol%2Bco mbo%2Bpics%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=koni+yellow+ground+control+combo+pics&docid=HaoovNqYKuDEbM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=Qo1NTrnRMfDWiALt3oSjAQ&sqi=2&ved=0CB0Q9QEwAQ&dur=4709
RalliNurse
08-18-2011, 03:54 PM
Thank you NFSLancerRA for pioneering this whole thing...I had a set of koni's on my old civic...loved it (too bad H&R springs blow them out)...but this time i'll def leave H&R's alone...can't wait to see the finishing product...
BeeGee
08-19-2011, 05:23 AM
These with Eibach Pro-Kit springs should be a pretty damn-decent setup.
Looking forward to this as I already have the Eibach's installed!
NFSLancerRA
08-19-2011, 06:39 AM
Looking forward to this as I already have the Eibach's installed!
I am just hoping that the RRM springs don't totally throw off this upgrade. It would be a bummer to pay for the shocks/struts and then turn around and buy new springs.
RRM & RRE are two different entities. Im sure you know about that, right?
NFSLancerRA
08-19-2011, 11:12 AM
RRM & RRE are two different entities. Im sure you know about that, right?
http://s3.amazonaws.com/kym-assets/entries/icons/original/000/000/015/orly.jpg?1229112642
rofl. :D YES RLY.
I remember I had called RRM trying pay for gift certificate for TheBlackbeast for sending me the swag bag from MOD 2010.
I had ordered some parts thinking I was talking to RRE
thru email & clubralliart I was pm'ing Mike@RRE but when I had called I was talking to RRM & they had no idea what the hell I was talking about... talk about how confused I was...:confused::D
NFSLancerRA
08-19-2011, 11:32 AM
I know that they are different. The only thing that I have from RRM is their spring kit. I am concerned about the rate of said springs.
Yeah, thats what I was trying to say without saying it. :rolleyes:
RRM are cool people & all but their parts are better for GTS, not for RA. ;)
Also RRM never disclosed their spring rate. They're made for show/lowering.
............
Found it
RRM 175 spring rates all around (Need confirmation)
Link
http://forums.evolutionm.net/lancer-tires-wheels-brakes-suspension-sponsored-tire-rack/307663-best-lowering-springs-08-gts-4.html
NFSLancerRA
08-19-2011, 12:28 PM
Looks like I need to order a set of Swift Springs. Those combined with Whiteline swaybars and new bushings should make for one nice handling ride. Coupled with the brakes and tires, this thing is going to be unstoppable.
My_Black_RA
08-19-2011, 06:01 PM
Looks like I need to order a set of Swift Springs. Those combined with Whiteline swaybars and new bushings should make for one nice handling ride. Coupled with the brakes and tires, this thing is going to be unstoppable.
Now that does sound like a nice combo!
Man I bet that will create a whole new beast!
NFSLancerRA
08-20-2011, 12:44 PM
I am trying to figure out how to calculate the exact dimensions of a suitable set of custom springs. How do you calculate the necessary compressed length of the spring based on the weight of the car, diameter of the spring, thickness of the material, spring coefficient (K), and free-standing height of the spring?
NFSLancerRA
08-30-2011, 06:26 PM
Never-mind all of that. Russ was nice enough to send me two. That makes life a lot easier. Now, I will just have the wizards at Koni create a set of spring to perfectly match. I am planning to have them lower the car as much as possible but maintain a 300# spring rate.
BravoZero
08-31-2011, 04:53 AM
Never-mind all of that. Russ was nice enough to send me two. That makes life a lot easier. Now, I will just have the wizards at Koni create a set of spring to perfectly match. I am planning to have them lower the car as much as possible but maintain a 300# spring rate.
I just figured you'd want to send them the entire assembly, including the springs. Plus, I don't have tools at home to get the springs off anyway, lol :D
So do you think they'd be able to create an entire dampener package that includes pre-installed springs, that way you can just buy them and immediately install them?
NFSLancerRA
08-31-2011, 05:45 AM
I just figured you'd want to send them the entire assembly, including the springs. Plus, I don't have tools at home to get the springs off anyway, lol :D
So do you think they'd be able to create an entire dampener package that includes pre-installed springs, that way you can just buy them and immediately install them?
I wish. The part of Koni that is going to make the dampeners is a completely different company, almost, than the one making the springs. I will have to call them about that, today, actually.
BravoZero
09-30-2011, 12:52 PM
What's the latest on this?
NFSLancerRA
09-30-2011, 02:42 PM
I hope to have the whole setup done by the time Boost for Boobs rolls around. The springs will be either 360/300 or 480/400 (I will speak to an engineer once they get there about recommended settings). I have removed the stock springs from the suspension components that I have and am wrapping them today and tomorrow for shipment. Once they come back, they will go with the old components to Koni for reconstruction. At the very latest, this will be done on November 18th. If I have to work overnight on the 19th to have them up and running on the 20th for Auto-X, so be it.
BravoZero
09-30-2011, 03:03 PM
I hope to have the whole setup done by the time Boost for Boobs rolls around. The springs will be either 360/300 or 480/400 (I will speak to an engineer once they get there about recommended settings). I have removed the stock springs from the suspension components that I have and am wrapping them today and tomorrow for shipment. Once they come back, they will go with the old components to Koni for reconstruction. At the very latest, this will be done on November 18th. If I have to work overnight on the 19th to have them up and running on the 20th for Auto-X, so be it.
Very nice... So basically once everything is said and done, we're going to have a complete badass suspension setup option? :D
NFSLancerRA
09-30-2011, 03:15 PM
Very nice... So basically once everything is said and done, we're going to have a complete badass suspension setup option? :D
I wouldn't have it any other way. I went all out with the brakes. I might as well do the same with the suspension. :D
Patiently waiting... Im curious to see what you come up with. :cool:
NFSLancerRA
09-30-2011, 03:56 PM
Patiently waiting... Im curious to see what you come up with. :cool:
:D
It won't disappoint. It drives me nuts that still no one makes an upgraded set of shocks/struts for this car. The Ralliart really is the bastard child of an Evo IX/X.
GAbOS
09-30-2011, 04:50 PM
:D
It won't disappoint. It drives me nuts that still no one makes an upgraded set of shocks/struts for this car. The Ralliart really is the bastard child of an Evo IX/X.
I agree. It's about the only upgrade I can make to my car for the class I drive and it would make a decent improvement to my times, I'm sure.
NFSLancerRA
09-30-2011, 04:59 PM
I agree. It's about the only upgrade I can make to my car for the class I drive and it would make a decent improvement to my times, I'm sure.
I feel for the guys who compete and are stuck at this current point. That was the expressed goal at the start of the project. What are the rules of your class? The last I checked, you couldn't touch inside the motor, you had to maintain stock wheel size, brakes had to be approved, and shocks/struts had to maintain OEM overall dimensions. Is that still the way of things?
Jackal
09-30-2011, 07:16 PM
Depends on your class, my Evo X wheels look like they came on the car so no one has ever questioned me on it LOL!
BravoZero
09-30-2011, 07:23 PM
Depends on your class, my Evo X wheels look like they came on the car so no one has ever questioned me on it LOL!
The Evo wheels also have the Mitsubishi logo on the center cap, so they probably didn't think much of it anyway.
GAbOS
10-01-2011, 12:31 PM
I feel for the guys who compete and are stuck at this current point. That was the expressed goal at the start of the project. What are the rules of your class? The last I checked, you couldn't touch inside the motor, you had to maintain stock wheel size, brakes had to be approved, and shocks/struts had to maintain OEM overall dimensions. Is that still the way of things?
In Stock:
I can't touch springs, but can replace struts/shocks as long as they mount to oem points.
I can use any brake pad compound, must retain oem rotors and lines.
Front sway bar can be changed, rear cannot.
Drop in air filter only, no modifications to intake.
cat back exhaust only.
Wheels must be oem size, can widen track up to 10mm (+5 on each side).
That's really about it. lol
Exyia
10-01-2011, 12:49 PM
In Stock:
I can't touch springs, but can replace struts/shocks as long as they mount to oem points.
I can use any brake pad compound, must retain oem rotors and lines.
Rear sway bar can be changed, front cannot.
Drop in air filter only, no modifications to intake.
cat back exhaust only.
Wheels must be oem size, can widen track up to 10mm (+5 on each side).
That's really about it. lol
I think it's front only, no rear in stock class
NFSLancerRA
10-01-2011, 12:54 PM
In Stock:
I can't touch springs, but can replace struts/shocks as long as they mount to oem points.
Basically, that means that you can touch the springs as long as the judges are too stupid to notice.
I can work with that.
GAbOS
10-01-2011, 01:06 PM
I think it's front only, no rear in stock class
You are correct. What was I thinking? ;)
Correction made.
BravoZero
10-01-2011, 04:30 PM
Question about this new setup...
Will we have options on ride height and different spring options?
GAbOS
10-01-2011, 06:14 PM
Basically, that means that you can touch the springs as long as the judges are too stupid to notice.
I can work with that.
Meh..
The usual tech inspector is the shop manager for the premier local SCCA pimped auto shop. He did my fenders and does my custom alignments. There's more than a good chance he could tell. ;>
Honesty is the best policy. Dont burn bridges or burn your good name or the rest of us RA owners.
Cheating is for cheaters. (unless you cheat to win) :p
I always do fun run, I dont care about time or points etc.
(actually I do, shhh dont tell anybody)
Dont have money to keep burning rubbers & brakes... so I dont really know all the rules, maybe one day I will sit down & read some track rules.
Too many rules & too many different classes...
GAbOS
10-01-2011, 08:12 PM
With ya there. There are too long standing basics in racing, and of course, they conflict. :)
If you're not winning, you're not cheating.
If the rules don't say you can, you cant.
To be honest, I would rather win by the rules. The car is a solid contender in stock.
NFSLancerRA
10-01-2011, 08:28 PM
Question about this new setup...
Will we have options on ride height and different spring options?
I can only afford to go ahead with one set of springs. They will lower the car 2" all the way around. The target point, as of now, is 480/400# springs. A friend of mine let me try out his 135i with that exact setup. Felt great.
I agree, stock RA is a contender in stock class.
I remember someone got challenged because someone else suspected that person of cheating & the guy was found guilty of cheating got kicked out. hahahaha. See ya'
On the sidenote: Someone showed up to car show a while ago with stolen rims & the owner called the cops, what a mess. Cheater/thieve soon get theirs.
I rather work for mine & prove that I can drive better with lesser car would be my greatest reward.
NFSLancerRA
10-01-2011, 08:31 PM
To be honest, this was a revelation that I did not need:
http://www.racingbrake.com/Z06_Brake_Pad_EZ_Bolt_p/z06-53.htm
I have to replace the stupid retaining bolts in my calipers to avoid Galvanic Corrosion. As you can see, those cost a pretty penny. I also have to go back in and exchange my Hawk HPS "padlets" for a solid one-piece pad. On top of that, I have to replace the front rotors and touch-up my rear rotors by November. I then have to get these springs out, paid for, and off to Koni. THis is going to be a long couple of weeks. It will be worth it, in the end, though.
NFSLancerRA
10-01-2011, 08:33 PM
I rather work for mine & prove that I can drive better with lesser car would be my greatest reward.
I wasn't advocating cheating. I know that it happens all the time, though.
There is no way that I would race in stock class, though. I want to go balls to the wall with this car.
Shit, I forgot about the widebody setup that I have been working on. Damn, I have a lot of work to.
Not saying you was.. but things happens people over look things.
Not everybody is into every car made so you could pull a fast one.
Sometimes you honestly dont know all the rules.. So it is not cheating if you dont know. :D
Speaking of brakes... Do you have a set of brackets for me?
Phase 1 = Bracket (so I can powdercoat them)
Phase 2 = SS lines (I had WORKS SS line but didnt WORK hand-me-down from wutangmo15) :(
Phase 3 = Rotors & Calipers
So.. speaking of suspension. autox champs are using 12kg/16kg rates for Evo IXs & VIII. FYI.
Yes, you do & as do I. Im doing side jobs to earn money to pay for things so time is very limited....
NFSLancerRA
10-02-2011, 07:12 AM
You haz PM.
Rralliart09
10-16-2013, 07:43 PM
What ever came of this? Did Koni end up making adjustables for the RA?
iralli_iskustvo
10-16-2013, 11:01 PM
These are going to be very beefy components. They should be cheaper than most coilovers and much higher quality.
Sounds very tempting.
Markspd6
10-17-2013, 03:51 PM
Havent heard of any good adj stuff, the best lower piroced coils would be STs, mae by KW, just not as fancy. I think theyre in the $800+ range for height adj, not sure on rebound.?
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