Electrical or mechanical boost gauge?

[BravoZero]

I'm thinking of not doing my EvoScan gauge idea and just go with a pair of physical gauges, one for boost and one for AFR. Before I purchase anything though, I need opinions as to which is better for this car... an electrical boost gauge or a mechanical boost gauge. Need to know which one is more accurate and more reliable.

[The Bullet]

in my opinion i think the electrical is the better way. I have purchased the AEM digital Boost and Digital Trans Temp. Was leaning towards the wideband but since i'm not tuned and don't really plan on it in the near future i went with trans temp. Hoping to run a wideband on my CTS with these gauges. AEM, Definately a brand i reccommend in gauges.

[Ralliart26]

I've had both electrical and mechanical boost gauges, from now on I'm going mechanical... way easier to install and reads the same. There is literally no difference. Unless your deciding between digital and analog gauges its really personal preference IMO.

[BravoZero]

Any pros and cons to digital or analog? Seems like anyone using EvoScan or any computerized gauges use a digital signal since it's plugged into the OBDII port.

[Ralliart26]

Most aftermarket AFR gauges you'd want to go digital like the LC-1 or Aem. I have the AEM AFR gauge, they plug right into your computer and log directly into evoscan. The others, evoscan already log so I personally didn't see the need for a digital boost gauge. You can log and read just about anything that has to do with your car except AFR. I got one to see if I was over boosting, or had a leak. Pros for digital they are accurate, cons are... they are quite expensive lol. Analog pros, they are cost efficient cons they aren't quite as accurate but who needs to know the difference between 25.9 psi and 26 psi :rolleyes:

[BravoZero]

Analog pros, they are cost efficient cons they aren't quite as accurate but who needs to know the difference between 25.9 psi and 26 psi :rolleyes:

Someone that's OCD, lol.

[Carlfer]

I prefer electric boost gauge. Installation is very easy, and you don't have a vacuum line coming into the cabin that may become kinked after installation. I have a Defi in my Ralliart, and like it a lot.

[Exyia]

mechanical will always be faster, but more involved to install

electrical is much easier, but CHEAP branded ones have huge delay. I didn't even bother to take off my Prosports when I traded in the RA - they pissed me off that badly

AEM digitals are the best of both worlds. Response of the AEM digitals is nearly instant

[BravoZero]

I'm currently looking into AEM gauges, specifically the electrical models.

The UEGO/gauge combo and the boost gauge. As long as it's "near" instant that's fine with me.

Anyone have opinions on where to mount gauges in these cars? As of right now, they're probably going to be mounted on my steering column off to the sides a bit so that most of my tach and speedo are visible, yet a cheap solution and easy to run the wiring.

[The Bullet]

rexpeed carbon fiber dual pod is the best i have seen by far.

[Exyia]

I'm currently looking into AEM gauges, specifically the electrical models.

The UEGO/gauge combo and the boost gauge. As long as it's "near" instant that's fine with me.

Anyone have opinions on where to mount gauges in these cars? As of right now, they're probably going to be mounted on my steering column off to the sides a bit so that most of my tach and speedo are visible, yet a cheap solution and easy to run the wiring.

they look better in the RA than the Evo is anything (red needles vs white and sweep angle)

I have no idea where my RA pics/vids went of the setup, but here's a recent one with the X - camera practically on my face to try and emulate the view. On the RA, it looks better since you don't have the 0's at 6 o'clock.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j221/XG08Zero/P1020921.jpg

[Drew]

Maybe I am old school, but this is my third AWD Turbo Mitsu, and I have had mechanical boost gauges in all 3. Installing a mechanical in our cars can be as easy or as hard as you make it. I can run the vacuum line from the a-pillar to the engine bay T in less than 10 minutes, because I have done it. For someone that hasn't done it, and doesn't know where to route it, it may take them an hour or more. Not that I don't trust the electrical boost gauges, but..........:rolleyes:

Is the mechanical harder to install? OK, I'll give you that. If mine was electrical, it would have taken me 4 minutes less to install...lol. That 4 minutes isn't worth my piece of mind.

2 cents

[Exyia]

Maybe I am old school, but this is my third AWD Turbo Mitsu, and I have had mechanical boost gauges in all 3. Installing a mechanical in our cars can be as easy or as hard as you make it. I can run the vacuum line from the a-pillar to the engine bay T in less than 10 minutes, because I have done it. For someone that hasn't done it, and doesn't know where to route it, it may take them an hour or more. Not that I don't trust the electrical boost gauges, but..........:rolleyes:

Is the mechanical harder to install? OK, I'll give you that. If mine was electrical, it would have taken me 4 minutes less to install...lol. That 4 minutes isn't worth my piece of mind.

2 cents

just to play devil's advocate

if your boost gauge loses connection, now you have a vacuum leak instead of a blank gauge :p

honestly I think it's more about which gauge brand - any decent electrical or mechanical will respond fast enough for eye-balling. if you need pinpoint accuracy/response, you should just data-log with Evoscan

[Drew]

just to play devil's advocate

if your boost gauge loses connection, now you have a vacuum leak instead of a blank gauge :p

honestly I think it's more about which gauge brand - any decent electrical or mechanical will respond fast enough for eye-balling. if you need pinpoint accuracy/response, you should just data-log with Evoscan

BUT if you lose connection, you know it INSTANTLY. And the odds of that hose creating a vacuum leak are just the same as all of the other vacuum lines under the hood creating one, if installed properly. Look at it this way. The part of a turbocharger that is the safety mechanism that keeps your engine from spooling up into oblivion (wastegate) uses a mechanical vacuum connection. Why not a "completely electrical" controlled wastegate? Because if an electrical glitch occurs (a "ghost in the machine"), your car craps hot metal pieces. Not to say I would never trust an electrical gauge. But the fact that they make mechanical ones makes them obsolete to me. It's kinda like the difference between an AF "sweeper" gauge and a wideband. One is right, and one should be close. I'll take right for $1000, Alex..

[BravoZero]

I don't plan on doing a whole lot to this car down the road, MAYBE a RAD turbo but that's about it. I don't think this car will ever see more than... 20-23 psi max? Not only that, I don't run the car hard every day at all. Maybe redline a couple of times on the weekend but I don't run the hell out of it when I do.

What would be the difference in using an electrical boost gauge as opposed to just using EvoScan gauges? I would think the electrical gauge would be the better of the two.

[GAbOS]

Drew makes a solid point. The only downside to mechanical is in what vacum hosing you use.

To the pic above and comment as to where zero is. I like that layout better. I would gladly put 0 further down to have shift zone at the top of the hour mark.

All decent racers use the tach, and not the speedo. :D

[Exyia]

BUT if you lose connection, you know it INSTANTLY. And the odds of that hose creating a vacuum leak are just the same as all of the other vacuum lines under the hood creating one, if installed properly. Look at it this way. The part of a turbocharger that is the safety mechanism that keeps your engine from spooling up into oblivion (wastegate) uses a mechanical vacuum connection. Why not a "completely electrical" controlled wastegate? Because if an electrical glitch occurs (a "ghost in the machine"), your car craps hot metal pieces. Not to say I would never trust an electrical gauge. But the fact that they make mechanical ones makes them obsolete to me. It's kinda like the difference between an AF "sweeper" gauge and a wideband. One is right, and one should be close. I'll take right for $1000, Alex..

that's sort of a silly comparison. the only way for an electric to fail is if the wire fails, or the sensor itself. If the sensor fails, it simply doesn't send a voltage to be interpreted by the gauge - nothing else. It doesn't disrupt the flow or anything

I'm saying if the connector into the gauge fails and pops out - electrical? open circuit, nothing happens. Mechanical? vacuum leak

but again, ultimately it really doesn't make a difference in concept - in reality, it's the quality of the gauge/brand. My prosport electric gauge was shit, but my AEM digital is as good as any mechanical (99% as fast as any mechanical). Electricity flows just as fast (if not faster) than the mechanical pressure, it's all determined in how fast the gauge reacts to it. My prosport was so terrible that it took too long to react to the signal, but the AEM responds instantly.

what happens when you see your gauge overboost? you hook up evoscan and actually datalog to find the exact area of the problem. all that really matters is if your gauge is accurate enough and quick enough to give you an idea where to look. gauges are just a reference, regardless of the type.

[Drew]

that's sort of a silly comparison. the only way for an electric to fail is if the wire fails, or the sensor itself. If the sensor fails, it simply doesn't send a voltage to be interpreted by the gauge - nothing else. It doesn't disrupt the flow or anything

I'm saying if the connector into the gauge fails and pops out - electrical? open circuit, nothing happens. Mechanical? vacuum leak

but again, ultimately it really doesn't make a difference in concept - in reality, it's the quality of the gauge/brand. My prosport electric gauge was shit, but my AEM digital is as good as any mechanical (99% as fast as any mechanical). Electricity flows just as fast (if not faster) than the mechanical pressure, it's all determined in how fast the gauge reacts to it. My prosport was so terrible that it took too long to react to the signal, but the AEM responds instantly.

what happens when you see your gauge overboost? you hook up evoscan and actually datalog to find the exact area of the problem. all that really matters is if your gauge is accurate enough and quick enough to give you an idea where to look. gauges are just a reference, regardless of the type.

Agree with everything you said. The one thing you are missing that makes me leary of electrical boost gauges is this.

Connector into the gauge fails and pops out - electrical? open circuit (You know it RIGHT away)

Vacuum line pops off. Mechanical? vacuum leak (You know it RIGHT away)

Something goes wrong with the voltage source to the electrical gauge that reduces the voltage, whether it be a resistive short, poor connection or contaminants on the contacts, you think you are running (boost A), but you are really running (boost B).

I think you are taking my opinion as me saying your gauge is crap. I'm not saying that at all. I'm sure it works absolutely great. But there is a fundamental possible error source with an electrical gauge that does not exist with a mechanical gauge, unless someone sneaks a pill inside your source line....lol.

[BravoZero]

Agree with everything you said. The one thing you are missing that makes me leary of electrical boost gauges is this.

Connector into the gauge fails and pops out - electrical? open circuit (You know it RIGHT away)

Vacuum line pops off. Mechanical? vacuum leak (You know it RIGHT away)

Something goes wrong with the voltage source to the electrical gauge that reduces the voltage, whether it be a resistive short, poor connection or contaminants on the contacts, you think you are running (boost A), but you are really running (boost B).

I think you are taking my opinion as me saying your gauge is crap. I'm not saying that at all. I'm sure it works absolutely great. But there is a fundamental possible error source with an electrical gauge that does not exist with a mechanical gauge, unless someone sneaks a pill inside your source line....lol.

Easy way to test whether or not the electrical gauge is malfunctioning is simply dataloggging. By running EvoScan and logging boost pressure, you can take note of what your gauge says and then go back to the log for that run as well. Compare the readings and if it's way off, then you know you have an issue. Besides, if you're overboosting, most times you'll know something isn't right.

[Exyia]

Agree with everything you said. The one thing you are missing that makes me leary of electrical boost gauges is this.

Connector into the gauge fails and pops out - electrical? open circuit (You know it RIGHT away)

Vacuum line pops off. Mechanical? vacuum leak (You know it RIGHT away)

Something goes wrong with the voltage source to the electrical gauge that reduces the voltage, whether it be a resistive short, poor connection or contaminants on the contacts, you think you are running (boost A), but you are really running (boost B).

I think you are taking my opinion as me saying your gauge is crap. I'm not saying that at all. I'm sure it works absolutely great. But there is a fundamental possible error source with an electrical gauge that does not exist with a mechanical gauge, unless someone sneaks a pill inside your source line....lol.

the part I'm trying to emphasize is that a vacuum leak causes wacky idle. A lost connection electrical gauge doesn't.

as for saying something will alter the voltage - all those described will simply just give a blank reading or a gauge that won't turn on. a short or poor connection doesn't cause altered signals - it just won't send a proper signal.

so electrical are a tad easier to install and deal with. that combined with having evoscan datalogging available for any purposeful accuracy, the decision is pretty mute.

[Cesarn2928]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/307217_2435894330016_1031434899_32780426_174818953 0_n.jpg

My Boost gauge is on Exhaust Temperature reading which wasnt install thats why it reads 39* as default lol.
but Electronic = BEAST :)

[Exyia]

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j221/XG08Zero/7ae6a262.jpg

;)