Ffl-2 not a good alternative - jacks trans.

[zeRep85]

Original post;

http://forums.evolutionm.net/10870477-post137.html


Quote:

Sorry for the slow response to this. I have been playing with different fluids in my personal test-mule and found the ffl fluid is not the same as the factory stuff. My trans developed a leak at the main seal where the t-case mates to the trans, and had an odd slipping issue in 4th gear when cold.

I then switched back to the factory SST fluid. The oil leak stopped and the 4th gear issue was gone.

I plan to spend more time on fluids here soon, but so far the only fluids I found which do not cause leaks and allow the clutches to work properly have been factory Nissan GT-R DCT fluid, SSP Gold, or OEM factory SST fluid.

There is something about those 3 fluids which have an ingredient we call the 'slime' coating. If you use a fluid in your SST which doesn't have this odd slime coating to it, the seals will leak. I have been unable to explain what this stuff is, but it's something the SST apparently needs. I know in the GT-R world this is not needed and many people are now using ATF in their GT-R, but the SST seems to get very upset if you do this.

For kicks I tried ATF in a known good SST and several quarts of the fluid leaked out of the seals in the trans. Again, I reinstalled the OEM SST factory fluid and the leak stopped. i never touched the seals. They leaked on their own with the new fluid I would try, then stop any time I went back to the OEM fluid.

So far I have played with ATF, engine oil, Nissan GT-R, Pentosin, SSP Gold, ffl and OEM SST fluid in the trans and all seem to make the unit run differently. Oddly enough the best fluid for shifting was straight Shell Rotella T engine oil, but everything else got pissed off with it in there.

I want to try to retest all of these fluids again with a fresh and rebuilt SST to see what happens. The SST I did these tests in previously was a factory untouched unit with a lot of miles.

Jack
JACKS TRANSMISSIONS

[OverCorrupt]

Good thing i havent done my tranny flush then! anyone wanna buy 8L of Pentosin fluid? :p

[zeRep85]

Hard to believe, when razorlab (bryan) ran this in his SB400 for quite some time with no issues.. :/

zeRep

[OverCorrupt]

Oh did not know that. interesting. Also so many other people in the FFL-2 Fluid swap thread, but i also figure they do not look at their under carriage that often without the cover on to see if their seals are leaking.

[zeRep85]

Oh did not know that. interesting. Also so many other people in the FFL-2 Fluid swap thread, but i also figure they do not look at their under carriage that often without the cover on to see if their seals are leaking.

I've been running it for the past ~40K with no KNOWN issues.. :/

I don't know how visible the leak would be without removing the tranny from the Tcase.

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[Markspd6]

the only reason i know of, the oils leaks through a seal like this, is when it's too thin for the application.. Or the seals themselves have issues, but since it stops when you go back, The fluids probly a close formula, but becomes too thin when hot or whatever, maybe those guys who had no issues, didn't notice small leaks? Or they had better cooling or ran in cooler temps.. So many variables. But, I've noticed in other cars, trans fluid is pretty sensitive stuff.

[Jackal]

Basically, nobody panic, continue on with what you have been doing.
So hurry up and wait.

There are so many of us out there that have switched over to FFL-2 in the last 18 months approx. and have put tens of thousands of km or miles on their cars combined. I think if there was a problem we would of seen multiple people coming forward by now.

I hope to go drag racing with my car next weekend and do some field testing to see how this fluid holds up.

[iralli_iskustvo]

Basically, nobody panic, continue on with what you have been doing.
So hurry up and wait.

There are so many of us out there that have switched over to FFL-2 in the last 18 months approx. and have put tens of thousands of km or miles on their cars combined. I think if there was a problem we would of seen multiple people coming forward by now.

I hope to go drag racing with my car next weekend and do some field testing to see how this fluid holds up.

I hope you do go drag racing and run your car harder than usual, looking forward to a positive outcome and how the fluid performs. You should post videos of you drag racing, would be fun to watch.

[Maj3st1k]

Why dont people just stick with stock fluid for peace of mind? Thats what im planning to do.

[cetme]

^^^ That's what I'm doin! Why risk a $10,000 tyranny to save $100? It doesn't make sense to me. :rolleyes:

[NFSLancerRA]

Hard to believe, when razorlab (bryan) ran this in his SB400 for quite some time with no issues.. :/

zeRep

It helps when you understand what you are talking about. Not knowing what fluids are safe even after a huge expose' on this site and EvolutionM is your problem.

[NFSLancerRA]

Why dont people just stick with stock fluid for peace of mind? Thats what im planning to do.

If you still don't feel safe picking a readily available and BETTER alternative to stock with hundreds of thousands of logged miles on many different cars the world over, feel free to stick with your stock fluid.

[crak]

Just FYI: Jacks transmission is not the go to for all SST info. Its just a guy that says, after running different fluids they go by feel and not scientific results.

[NFSLancerRA]

I should probably clarify what I mean:

1). SSP Gold is FFL-2 type fluid. Jack's said that that works just fine. If you want Gold fluid for less than what SSP or anyone else sells it for, go to your local Audi dealer and get DSG fluid. You will notice that it is gold in color.

2). I noticed that my RA ran better with the DSG fluid. I ran it for thousands of miles before my car was written off. No slow down lights. Nothing. The cars do like this fluid. Many people run this stuff and don't post online about it. I should have kept my mouth shut and sold it. The stuff is awesome.

3). There were a couple of threads posted about running straight Pentosin FFL-2. I have no experience with the raw fluid formulation. I never bought any to do testing with, so that is really what is experimental. I think that people are grouping all fluids together, and that is not accurate information. The TC-SST can and will run properly with upgraded fluid. Those on the fence about running new stuff, do what I did. Get the DSG fluid. Do not let this thread scare you away from trying something new. That was not the intention of Jack's. They are a great shop, and they do great work. The transmissions that I have seen sent there come back flawlessly, and most if not all of them got DSG/SSP Gold fluid. That is an upgrade over stock.

[NFSLancerRA]

Just FYI: Jacks transmission is not the go to for all SST info. Its just a guy that says, after running different fluids they go by feel and not scientific results.

That is exactly what I didn't want this to turn into. They know their stuff. I believe that the intent of this information was mishandled and misunderstood.

[iralli_iskustvo]

^^^ That's what I'm doin! Why risk a $10,000 tyranny to save $100? It doesn't make sense to me. :rolleyes:

Where are you purchasing your Diaqueen?

[iralli_iskustvo]

I should probably clarify what I mean:

1). SSP Gold is FFL-2 type fluid. Jack's said that that works just fine. If you want Gold fluid for less than what SSP or anyone else sells it for, go to your local Audi dealer and get DSG fluid. You will notice that it is gold in color.

2). I noticed that my RA ran better with the DSG fluid. I ran it for thousands of miles before my car was written off. No slow down lights. Nothing. The cars do like this fluid. Many people run this stuff and don't post online about it. I should have kept my mouth shut and sold it. The stuff is awesome.

3). There were a couple of threads posted about running straight Pentosin FFL-2. I have no experience with the raw fluid formulation. I never bought any to do testing with, so that is really what is experimental. I think that people are grouping all fluids together, and that is not accurate information. The TC-SST can and will run properly with upgraded fluid. Those on the fence about running new stuff, do what I did. Get the DSG fluid. Do not let this thread scare you away from trying something new. That was not the intention of Jack's. They are a great shop, and they do great work. The transmissions that I have seen sent there come back flawlessly, and most if not all of them got DSG/SSP Gold fluid. That is an upgrade over stock.

You had DSG fluid in your RA correct? Was it this exact same fluid: Audi/ VW DSG fluid part No. G 052 529 A2? I believe Oreilly and Autozone have them as well. Is there a better price for this fluid somewhere else?

[RalliNurse]

I ran ffl 2 since I drain the dia-queen at 16000and changed the filter....now I'm at 21200 miles with no issues...I will redo the drain and fill @ about 30000 just to keep it clean...after that then it'll be 60000 miles swap...

[RalliNurse]

I should probably clarify what I mean:

1). SSP Gold is FFL-2 type fluid. Jack's said that that works just fine. If you want Gold fluid for less than what SSP or anyone else sells it for, go to your local Audi dealer and get DSG fluid. You will notice that it is gold in color.

2). I noticed that my RA ran better with the DSG fluid. I ran it for thousands of miles before my car was written off. No slow down lights. Nothing. The cars do like this fluid. Many people run this stuff and don't post online about it. I should have kept my mouth shut and sold it. The stuff is awesome.

3). There were a couple of threads posted about running straight Pentosin FFL-2. I have no experience with the raw fluid formulation. I never bought any to do testing with, so that is really what is experimental. I think that people are grouping all fluids together, and that is not accurate information. The TC-SST can and will run properly with upgraded fluid. Those on the fence about running new stuff, do what I did. Get the DSG fluid. Do not let this thread scare you away from trying something new. That was not the intention of Jack's. They are a great shop, and they do great work. The transmissions that I have seen sent there come back flawlessly, and most if not all of them got DSG/SSP Gold fluid. That is an upgrade over stock.

What he said I completely agree!

[iralli_iskustvo]

I ran ffl 2 since I drain the dia-queen at 16000and changed the filter....now I'm at 21200 miles with no issues...I will redo the drain and fill @ about 30000 just to keep it clean...after that then it'll be 60000 miles swap...

So you are sticking with the FFL-2 fluid on your next tranny fluid change? What is the exact part number of the FFL-2 fluid you are using?

[NFSLancerRA]

You had DSG fluid in your RA correct? Was it this exact same fluid: Audi/ VW DSG fluid part No. G 052 529 A2? I believe Oreilly and Autozone have them as well. Is there a better price for this fluid somewhere else?

I get my DSG fluid from a local VW dealer. The cost is $17 per liter.

[BravoZero]

This is why I love the manual trans in my car. No need to worry about this kind of stuff.

Just thought I'd put that out there, lol.

[iralli_iskustvo]

I get my DSG fluid from a local VW dealer. The cost is $17 per liter.

Ok cool I will call my local VW dealer. So this I am assuming is not it - http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/PNT0/1038107/07067.oap?year=2006&make=Volkswagen&model=GTI&vi=1433155&ck=Search_07067_1433155_-1&pt=07067&ppt=C0207

[Jackal]

You had DSG fluid in your RA correct? Was it this exact same fluid: Audi/ VW DSG fluid part No. G 052 529 A2? I believe Oreilly and Autozone have them as well. Is there a better price for this fluid somewhere else?

Yes you yourself even quoted the part No.
"Audi/ VW DSG fluid part No. G 052 529 A2" LOL!

This is what I have been putting in the Ralliarts I have serviced including my own.


^^^ That's what I'm doin! Why risk a $10,000 tyranny to save $100? It doesn't make sense to me. :rolleyes:


WTF? Where are you only seeing a $100 savings? You got savings on Labour, then the oil and the filter. Average price to get an SST fluid and filter change at dealers where I live is between $800 to $1100. I can buy Audi fluid for around $200 and filter from either SSP or Ebay for under $90 even with tax and shipping.

This isn't about just the fluid but everything need to be able to complete this fluid service on the car.

[iralli_iskustvo]

Yes you yourself even quoted the part No.
"Audi/ VW DSG fluid part No. G 052 529 A2" LOL!

This is what I have been putting in the Ralliarts I have serviced including my own.





WTF? Where are you only seeing a $100 savings? You got savings on Labour, then the oil and the filter. Average price to get an SST fluid and filter change at dealers where I live is between $800 to $1100. I can buy Audi fluid for around $200 and filter from either SSP or Ebay for under $90 even with tax and shipping.

This isn't about just the fluid but everything need to be able to complete this fluid service on the car.

Yes I did quoted the part number, just want to verify with others and double check! Thanks to Jackal for the fluid part number and NFS for the FFL-2 container pics.

[zeRep85]

That is exactly what I didn't want this to turn into. They know their stuff. I believe that the intent of this information was mishandled and misunderstood.

how so?

Jack posted;
FFL fluid is not the same as OEM
After switching he developed a leak
He also developed an odd slippage issue in fourth gear
He switched back and it magically fixed itself

Unless by FFL fluid he meant FFL-1,3 and 4 and NOT FFL-2?

On that note, I plan to stay on FFL-2 until said symptoms develop.

zeRep

[crak]

I also recall NSFLancer saying this awhile back:


NFSLancerRA
02-12-2012, 01:42 PM
Since this cherry has been popped, I will fill you in on what I know.

SSP Pro Gold IS FFL-2 (also known as Audi/VW DSG fluid). Buy a can and check the color, if you want to. I ran DSG fluid in my car for 10,000 miles, and the transmission ran perfectly. You CAN use Porsche DPK fluid. To my knowledge, that is FFL-3. FFL-4 should be BMW DSG fluid. I hope that that helps.

[mangnok]

I also recall NSFLancer saying this awhile back:


NFSLancerRA
02-12-2012, 01:42 PM
Since this cherry has been popped, I will fill you in on what I know.

SSP Pro Gold IS FFL-2 (also known as Audi/VW DSG fluid). Buy a can and check the color, if you want to. I ran DSG fluid in my car for 10,000 miles, and the transmission ran perfectly. You CAN use Porsche DPK fluid. To my knowledge, that is FFL-3. FFL-4 should be BMW DSG fluid. I hope that that helps.

I use FFL2 for about 25,000 miles now

[cetme]

Yes you yourself even quoted the part No.
"Audi/ VW DSG fluid part No. G 052 529 A2" LOL!

This is what I have been putting in the Ralliarts I have serviced including my own.





WTF? Where are you only seeing a $100 savings? You got savings on Labour, then the oil and the filter. Average price to get an SST fluid and filter change at dealers where I live is between $800 to $1100. I can buy Audi fluid for around $200 and filter from either SSP or Ebay for under $90 even with tax and shipping.

This isn't about just the fluid but everything need to be able to complete this fluid service on the car.

I do all my own work so labor isnt't an issue, but to me risking $10,000 is to much. But I'm not much of a gambler ;) I'm not saying that these other fluids won't work just that if people are worried about them just stick to the stock fluid thats all.

[zeRep85]

I do all my own work so labor isnt't an issue, but to me risking $10,000 is to much. But I'm not much of a gambler ;) I'm not saying that these other fluids won't work just that if people are worried about them just stick to the stock fluid thats all.

I did it, not only because it was cheaper but because it was a better fluid.

zeRep

[total0wnage]

I used ffl-2 last change, every since i used it ive been getting the same 4th gear random slip, i dont think its only when its cold tho, it happens even when transmission is warm. ill try switching back to diaqueen and see if i have any issues

[crak]

Guess what folks! Its all the same. Jacks transmission can be questionable about their science. In the posts below a guy dug around to look into who made what and what is similar. So Jacks transmission thinks that one fluid fails but another works. How can that be if the fluids are the same? They must be using FFL-1

http://forums.evolutionm.net/mitsubishi-tc-sst-discussion-all-equipped-models/590515-all-about-sst-fluid.html

[TrailBrake]

Call me conservative, but I am sticking with Diaqueen and the factory paper filter while my car is under warranty. As well, I am going to change the fluid and filter every year (10-15,000 km) as the car sees some track time as well.

For those in Canada looking for Diaqueen for $50 less per 4L can than at the dealer, give Alpha Motorsports a try:
http://alphamotorsports.ca/contact/

That said, I am certainly interested in hearing what comes out of this thread though, as there will come a time when I want something a little more robust than stock.

[zeRep85]

In the posts below a guy dug around to look into who made what and what is similar. So Jacks transmission thinks that one fluid fails but another works. How can that be if the fluids are the same? They must be using FFL-1

http://forums.evolutionm.net/mitsubishi-tc-sst-discussion-all-equipped-models/590515-all-about-sst-fluid.html

That's the thread where Jack posted about the fluids

Page 10

zeRep

[crak]

I see it. I just dont understand how the same fluid acts differently.

I have a better idea. http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

They perform oil tests.

I have FFL-2 fluid and what I am going to do is send in some FFL-2 i still have thats brand new and some from my car. So i will have two test results. The control and the sample.

I guess if anyone else wants to help get to the bottom of this, asks for two sample kits from blackstone and test the diaqeen control and test from a car.

Even from DSG if you can help gather test samples.

what do u think?

[iralli_iskustvo]

I see it. I just dont understand how the same fluid acts differently.

I have a better idea. http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

They perform oil tests.

I have FFL-2 fluid and what I am going to do is send in some FFL-2 i still have thats brand new and some from my car. So i will have two test results. The control and the sample.

I guess if anyone else wants to help get to the bottom of this, asks for two sample kits from blackstone and test the diaqeen control and test from a car.

Even from DSG if you can help gather test samples.

what do u think?

That sounds like getting to the bottom of this "he said, she said talk" lol.

[crak]

So, I already packaged up my FFL-2 and sent it off to the labs. Ill post back here with the results soon. IF anyone in the mean time wants to send in DSG or diaqueen that would help speed this up.

[Splattj]

I know with Mistus/Diaqueen for the manual transmissions Mistu would add a friction additive for their synchros. I wouldn't be surprise if they took basic FFL-2 and put something in it. In for lab results.

[crak]

I know with Mistus/Diaqueen for the manual transmissions Mistu would add a friction additive for their synchros. I wouldn't be surprise if they took basic FFL-2 and put something in it. In for lab results.

I opted for the additive test with blackstone labs. So we will also see if FFL-2 contains the said additives.

[zeRep85]

w00t w00t!

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[iralli_iskustvo]

I opted for the additive test with blackstone labs. So we will also see if FFL-2 contains the said additives.

How long you think it will take till you get the results back?

[crak]

1-4 weeks.

[TrailBrake]

Crak, thank you for investing the time and expense to get the lab testing done. We as a community appreciate the effort!

[iralli_iskustvo]

Crak, thank you for investing the time and expense to get the lab testing done. We as a community appreciate the effort!

I agree! Thank you Crak.

[zeRep85]

Thank you Crak!

Also thank me for getting the ball rollin' with the post! hehehe

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[crak]

I am just doing FFL-2! If we could compile more tests on the other oils we can officially get to the bottom of this!

[zeRep85]

I am just doing FFL-2! If we could compile more tests on the other oils we can officially get to the bottom of this!

Since you already made contact with the lab...maybe we can paypal you monies to get some Diaqueen?

zeRep

[crak]

Well, Ill ask my bud at mitusubishi if he has any extra lying around and i can get a container of it. The cost for the lab test is 35$. If anyone wants to help contribute, I can do all the tests.

I can go to a volks dealer and pick up a quart of DSG. In the end this might just all cost ~100$ for the DSG and two more tests since ill get a sample of diaqueen for free. If you care to donate to get this all figured out send it to my email: crakbanville @ gmail dot com

[iralli_iskustvo]

Thank you Crak!

Also thank me for getting the ball rollin' with the post! hehehe

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Thank you sir :)

[iralli_iskustvo]

Well, Ill ask my bud at mitusubishi if he has any extra lying around and i can get a container of it. The cost for the lab test is 35$. If anyone wants to help contribute, I can do all the tests.

I can go to a volks dealer and pick up a quart of DSG. In the end this might just all cost ~100$ for the DSG and two more tests since ill get a sample of diaqueen for free. If you care to donate to get this all figured out send it to my email: crakbanville @ gmail dot com

How to donate, I dont have paypal..

[total0wnage]

Thanks crak for doing this, the more we find out about these cars the better it will be for modding and reliability for everyone.

[TrailBrake]

zeRep85, excellent suggestion re: Paypal contribution. I'm down with that.

Crak, what is the minimum sample size for analysis (1L)?

Maybe someone has a little unused Diaqueen left over so purchasing an entire 4L can can be avoided. The cheapest I can get a can of Diaqueen for is about $140CDN.

[crak]

zeRep85, excellent suggestion re: Paypal contribution. I'm down with that.

Crak, what is the minimum sample size for analysis (1L)?

Maybe someone has a little unused Diaqueen left over so purchasing an entire 4L can can be avoided. The cheapest I can get a can of Diaqueen for is about $140CDN.

its a 100mL sample size.

[zeRep85]

its a 100mL sample size.

dang, hopefully your buddy at the dealership can hook you up! or sell you that much.

zeRep

[TrailBrake]

I have two brand new cans of Diaqueen that I'm saving for my first fluid change. Worst case, I can pour out 100ml from one and send it to you Crak.

[crak]

Not a bad idea. I have no problem sending it all in. But would you rather get a test kit for yourself from http://www.blackstone-labs.com/free-test-kits.php and send it in?

Up to you though:)

[iralli_iskustvo]

Not a bad idea. I have no problem sending it all in. But would you rather get a test kit for yourself from http://www.blackstone-labs.com/free-test-kits.php and send it in?

Up to you though:)

Crak, how can I donate to you buddy for your generous work? Lol I can send money through "money gram" at walmart..

[Smeghead]

i have a little less then a quart of diaqueen left from my sst fluid change I could donate being that i still have to buy 2 gallons when I do the change again in two years

[crak]

Got two more sample kits. Ill hit up the dealership today or tomorrow to see if they have any extra diaqueen lying around. Then the last sample I need is DSG.

[crak]

I'm going to get some DSG fluid tomorrow. If you guys feel like donating me some funds for this research i would greatly appreciate it!

The FFL-2 results already came in. So far it all looks standard.

[crak]

Results are in... I haven't had time to research what each value means or to find out which one is better. So, I will leave that up to you guys to figure this one out.

FFL-2 and dsg look identical diaqueen however has more phosphorous. Find out what phosphorous does to our trannys would be a good start.

I asked them which oil is best out of the three. they said they would use diaqueen. (oh no for all others that dont use it.) Now that we have results we need research!

http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/832/4k82.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/832/4k82.png/)
http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/41/45rc.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/41/45rc.png/)
http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/94/xrw3.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/94/xrw3.png/)

[Napius]

Thank you very much for your time and money spent on this! I look forward to seeing what else comes of it.

[iralli_iskustvo]

Results are in... I haven't had time to research what each value means or to find out which one is better. So, I will leave that up to you guys to figure this one out.

FFL-2 and dsg look identical diaqueen however has more phosphorous. Find out what phosphorous does to our trannys would be a good start.

I asked them which oil is best out of the three. they said they would use diaqueen. (oh no for all others that dont use it.) Now that we have results we need research!

http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/832/4k82.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/832/4k82.png/)
http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/41/45rc.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/41/45rc.png/)
http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/94/xrw3.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/94/xrw3.png/)

Thanks for you time and contribution Crak. I hope these results will conclude all the talk about which fluids are better for the SST.

[iralli_iskustvo]

More phosphorous means a positive thing for our tranny right?

[iralli_iskustvo]

Im sure someone red all this before, but for people who didnt..here you go -

http://forums.evolutionm.net/mitsubishi-tc-sst-discussion-all-equipped-models/590515-all-about-sst-fluid.html

[NFSLancerRA]

You will find that Phosphorus concentrations increase with Sulfur content (or at least they should). These two elements combined increase the thermo-stability of the fluid, which is meant to decrease wear on the internal workings of the transmission.

Notice that Bryan references FFL-3 and FFL-4 in his post. Funny that I have PMs on EvoM with him from a month before explaining the fluid differences to him and what they were used for. Food for thought.

[TrailBrake]

Now we have the straight goods. Crak, your efforts are greatly appreciated.

[crak]

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/engine-oil-analysis/

good read to understand the oil analysis

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2692247&page=1

good read on SST fluids.

FFL-2
FZG A/8.3/90 = 12
FZG A/16.6/90 = 12
FZG A/16.6/120 = 9
FZG A/10/16.6R/120 = 6

FFL-4
FZG A/8.3/90 = 12
FZG A/16.6/90 = 12
FZG A/16.6/120 = 12
FZG A/10/16.6R/120 = 7/8

FFL-2 Plus Plus
FZG A/8.3/90 = 12
FZG A/16.6/90 = 12
FZG A/16.6/120 = 12
FZG A/10/16.6R/120 = 9/10

From what I have found, the first two tests are operated at a temperature of 90C, the second two at 120C. The last test should be listed as "FZG A10/16.6R/120" without the slash after the 'A'.

I also found this:


Scuffing load stage FZG test: input scuffing load stage as specified in the FZG test.
1= weakest level; 12=best level
Good gear lubricants all have scuffing load level 12.


So, where can i find FFL-2 Plus plus?

[crak]

Called up blackstone to get a better idea of whats going on. In conclusion they said that right now, we cant tell what is a good oil even off if something has more additives. The guy I spoke with said he has seen oils with low additives work better on transmissions and engines better then some oils with more additives.

So, two conclusions were made:

1) The results we have tell us nothing. so therefore,
2) We need to collect USED SST oil in order to compare the trace metals and determine which oil type has the least amount of ware on the SST. (This is what the guy and I determined is the best way to figure out the best oil for our cars).

I might be able to get some Diaqueen used from the dealership. For FFL-2 and DSG I will need to wait on anyone that is doing a transmission flush soon to collect these samples.

If anyone is doing a transmission flush and would like to contribute to this by shipping me some used oil, please PM me.

[cjsabaki]

OK, here is my story and take on this for what little it is worth...........

2009 Ralliart I bought the car used with 36,000 on her, odd thing is its a 2009 but the SST only has the 2 drain plugs.

At 40,000 miles I serviced the SST with a new filter and moved to FFL-2 fluid, at 58,000 changed the filter and moved to FFL-3.

Now at 70,000 miles and about to change the filter and move BACK to SSTF Diaqueen fluid. I will post my feelings after a few weeks of driving to saturate the clutch materials with the OE fluids.


Chris

[ROMITON1]

OK, here is my story and take on this for what little it is worth...........

2009 Ralliart I bought the car used with 36,000 on her, odd thing is its a 2009 but the SST only has the 2 drain plugs.

At 40,000 miles I serviced the SST with a new filter and moved to FFL-2 fluid, at 58,000 changed the filter and moved to FFL-3.

Now at 70,000 miles and about to change the filter and move BACK to SSTF Diaqueen fluid. I will post my feelings after a few weeks of driving to saturate the clutch materials with the OE fluids.


Chris

Slightly off topic, but not much.

I also have a 2009, I am the original owner, regular service, always Diaqueen, I have never had any issues with the SST, or timing chain, and the car is full bolt-on + tune.

I wonder if they altered something from the original production specs.

My car is also one of the earlier production #'s ... seems to be quite a solid car to me, 5 years going, zero issues, fully modified minus turbo swap.

[cjsabaki]

Slightly off topic, but not much.

I also have a 2009, I am the original owner, regular service, always Diaqueen, I have never had any issues with the SST, or timing chain, and the car is full bolt-on + tune.

I wonder if they altered something from the original production specs.

My car is also one of the earlier production #'s ... seems to be quite a solid car to me, 5 years going, zero issues, fully modified minus turbo swap.

My car production date is 12/08 so fairly early build too. Does ur SST have the 2 or 3 drain plugs in the bottom???

Chris

[wutangmo15]

OK, here is my story and take on this for what little it is worth...........

2009 Ralliart I bought the car used with 36,000 on her, odd thing is its a 2009 but the SST only has the 2 drain plugs.

At 40,000 miles I serviced the SST with a new filter and moved to FFL-2 fluid, at 58,000 changed the filter and moved to FFL-3.

Now at 70,000 miles and about to change the filter and move BACK to SSTF Diaqueen fluid. I will post my feelings after a few weeks of driving to saturate the clutch materials with the OE fluids.


Chris

Did you switch back to the Diaqueen? I'm curious to see if you noticed any difference between the 3 fluids.

[So-Cal]

Wondering if anyone came to a consensus on whats ok to run? Will ffl-2 and audi/volvo stuff fry our board thats sitting inside the liquid? Seems everyone was finding ffl-2 to be ok, maybe now people have had enough time to know if it'll "fry" the board.

About to do this whole procedure now, I'm skeptical though because of the missing levels of phosphorus ffl-2 and other substitutes supposedly don't have.
diaqueen only?

HELP! :confused::cool:

[zeRep85]

Wondering if anyone came to a consensus on whats ok to run? Will ffl-2 and audi/volvo stuff fry our board thats sitting inside the liquid? Seems everyone was finding ffl-2 to be ok, maybe now people have had enough time to know if it'll "fry" the board.

About to do this whole procedure now, I'm skeptical though because of the missing levels of phosphorus ffl-2 and other substitutes supposedly don't have.
diaqueen only?

HELP! :confused::cool:

If your skeptical then just run Diaqueen...

If i still had my RA i would have switched back to Diaqueen.

zeRep

[Jackal]

If your skeptical then just run Diaqueen...

If i still had my RA i would have switched back to Diaqueen.

zeRep

+1 to switching back to Diaqeen!

I still have my 2009 RA and yes I have switched back to Diaqeen. Now that there are sources to order the proper fluid at a competitive price there no reason not to run the proper fluid. Just don't forget to order a filter.

[Markspd6]

Wondering if anyone came to a consensus on whats ok to run? Will ffl-2 and audi/volvo stuff fry our board thats sitting inside the liquid? Seems everyone was finding ffl-2 to be ok, maybe now people have had enough time to know if it'll "fry" the board.

About to do this whole procedure now, I'm skeptical though because of the missing levels of phosphorus ffl-2 and other substitutes supposedly don't have.
diaqueen only?

HELP! :confused::cool:

Not nuch concensus really, but if you wanna play it safe you know the answer, go OEM. The ersosion might take quite a while, so i wouldnt expect a real answer quickly..