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  #1  
Old 01-22-2013, 10:29 PM
Ralliart 09 Ralliart 09 is offline
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Default 09 Ralliart Timing Chain (Sorry to re-post but need urgent help)

Hi All, new member here having major dramas with stealership and timing chain issues.

My partner owns a 2009 Lancer Raliiart as her daily driver purchased second handwith 9000k and warranty transfer. Had the car inspected and given extended 2yr warranty at 35 000k (3years old), 3800k later and the timing chaing warning light has illumated on the MIL.

Diamond Assist then had the car towed to local stealership (same shop who did last service and extended mitsubishi warranty) and we were informed they have to do a visual inspection on timing chain at our expense as it may not be under warranty due to excessive abuse of the car.

Stealership has then visually inspected chain and informed us the chain is well withing the visual guide and there is 0% stretched according to visual ispection (chain was on corrct side of visual mark and appears to be no stretch). This got me doing some research and I stumbled across the Techical Service Bulletin regarding the P0012 code, 'An incorrect parameter in the
judgment criteria may cause mis−detection of a fault even though the timing chain elongation rate remains within the specified allowance'

I then asked the tech if they had knowledge of this TSB and they was told they did not and that he could not find it anywhere (which gave no confidence in their knowledge and workmanship) so I forwarded him the TSB PDF at quite a surprise to the Tech as he was under the assumption there was no way I could have aquired it.

After a couple of days of still not knowing exactly (if anything) is wrong with the vehicle I am finally contacted by Service depatrment and told they are now concerned about teeth wear on the both vvt and crankshaft sprockets but are unsure as they don't have a new part to compare it to. I then start asking questions and am passed to a mechanic who informs me he doesn't beleive the teeth look that bad at all.

A couple of days later I am then emailed the following from the service department -

MMAL have informed me that they will pay a part only claim because of poor service history- possible contributing factor to premature chain/sprocket
wear- poor lubrication.
We have asked for Timing chain, both vct phasers, timing chain tensioner, oil pump chain and sprocket, seals and gaskets. One of the cam phasers is nil Australia. Please indicate if you wish me to order the parts.

Now in regards to poor service history the car has only gone over 2 services by about 1000K and the car has not been driven hard on a daily basis.

Sorry for the long post guys but wanted to give you all the info.

I am still unsure what exactly is wrong with the car and if I am getting screwed over by a useless stealership and may end up paying for un-needed parts.

If anyone could give some input into the matter it would be greatly appreciated, thanks in advance.

Alex (Ralliart 09)
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  #2  
Old 01-23-2013, 05:08 AM
TrailBrake TrailBrake is offline
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Unfortunately I have heard of situations like this before, and I know it offers little consolation, but your partner is not alone. There may be very little wiggle room here. If the oil wasn't changed 100% as per schedule, they won't cover the entire cost. This is despite the chains all the way up to the 2012 model year are prone to stretch more than the revised chain.

I can't access YouTube from where I am now, but if you do a search, there is a factory training video that mentions oil change interval contributing to chain stretch.

Mitsu is extremely anal about the maintenance schedule when it comes to warranty claims. Because of this, I have all my fluids changed well in advance of the severe maintenance schedule due date. Keep every receipt. Do you have all the service records from the original owner?

With all that said, if you can subscribe to a service like Michell1's eAutoRepair.net, you will have access to all the technical information you need to verify if the parts listed are in fact related or required/recommended to replace with the timing chain.

Last edited by TrailBrake; 01-23-2013 at 10:04 AM.
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Old 01-23-2013, 07:43 AM
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MTZL MTZL is offline
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dealership told me the same thing about oil changes yesterday since i change my own oil. One of the reason why i opted mmcs so i can log all maintenance performed.

there is a tsb out for reflash, the reflash took care my p0016.

i am at 54k miles, i am hoping timing chain replacement under 60k miles warranty.
if not i am preparing for worst case scenario of replacing timing chain at my expense.

sm told me they dont replace timing chain. yes they know very little about cars and service. i know it is not comforting. this is what we all have to deal with.

"i see these type of people all the time"
everywhere.

what is her total mileage now?
does it idle roughly?
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Last edited by MTZL; 01-23-2013 at 07:46 AM.
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:07 AM
Ralliart 09 Ralliart 09 is offline
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Thanks for the replies guys.

Through my research I did come across the issue of the timing chain being prone to stretch as this was my first concern, but as per the visual inspection (as performed in training video) from the dealership the chain had 0% strecth, or so they informed me.

I have no issues replacing timing chain even if it isn't stretched as I would like to have the upgraded version with the 8 links for peice of mind in the future.

My main concern with the whole issue is with some of the parts they are proposing to replace being the VCT phasers, oil pump sprocket and timing chain tensioner even though the chain was not stretched.

I can not find a great amount of info on these parts, but to anyones knowledge ??? could all these parts need replacing before the faulty timing chain had stretched beyond 0.6% and could all this damage be caused by going over oil changes by 1000K a couple of times.

I have a few other thoughts on the matter being that the dealership that serviced the car and did the check over the car, whilst knowing the service history still gave us the extended warranty. Then 3000k later we have major dramas due to the faulty timing chain and that they are trying to get out of rectifying under warranty due to my knowledge of the faulty chain issue

(yes I stupidly told them I knew about the faulty chain issue and that there had being a revised chain released due to common excessive chain stretch when I was first informed of the issue and told it may not be covered under warranty)

Also they have not being able to inform me exactly what is wrong or what happened as such to cause the damages to the parts. They can not confirm with me if the timing was actually out or why the check timing chain warning light has shown although the timing chain was not stretched as per visual inspection.

If anyone has any info on the matter and the queries above or might be able to suggest some questions I could ask the dealer to get to the bottom of it and give me piece of mind it would be more than helpful.

ps. SORRY FOR LONG POST AGAIN
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:10 AM
Ralliart 09 Ralliart 09 is offline
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BTW guys love the site, found so much useful info on here when I was researching the fault, lots of great collective knowledge.
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:16 AM
Ralliart 09 Ralliart 09 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTZL View Post
dealership told me the same thing about oil changes yesterday since i change my own oil. One of the reason why i opted mmcs so i can log all maintenance performed.

there is a tsb out for reflash, the reflash took care my p0016.

i am at 54k miles, i am hoping timing chain replacement under 60k miles warranty.
if not i am preparing for worst case scenario of replacing timing chain at my expense.

sm told me they dont replace timing chain. yes they know very little about cars and service. i know it is not comforting. this is what we all have to deal with.

"i see these type of people all the time"
everywhere.

what is her total mileage now?
does it idle roughly?
38500KM on the clock and she was idling fine when we last had the car. Also car has had quite an easy life considering what the car is capable of.
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:18 AM
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crak crak is offline
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IF anything, get them to change the chain to the new updated double link chain while they have your engine opened.

http://roadraceengineering.com/blog/?tag=ralliart

Get them to show you your timing chain compared to another. IF the car threw a code, get them to flash the ecu with the newest firmware. That should fix the issue if the chain is not stretched.

To be honest, more and more I talk to Mitsubishi mechanics and they think they are gods gift because they have training, and manuals to help them out. But in reality they cant think outside of the box like we can. They mainly are lemmings so they tell you what the book knows and not what they can tell you from experience. They will also take a hit on their ego because you know more then the expert (which is them) on the matter. You pretty much have to be adamant on what you want or else they will give you the easy way out and not want to do the real work. Just keep on with your research and tell them what you want done.

All that crap should be covered under warranty too. Its their problem not yours that they sold you a lemon, they should be obligated to fix it.

Last edited by crak; 01-23-2013 at 10:26 AM.
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:36 AM
TrailBrake TrailBrake is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralliart 09 View Post
I have a few other thoughts on the matter being that the dealership that serviced the car and did the check over the car, whilst knowing the service history still gave us the extended warranty. Then 3000k later we have major dramas due to the faulty timing chain and that they are trying to get out of rectifying under warranty due to my knowledge of the faulty chain issue
It is a normal to assume due diligence from dealers, but as many of us here are painfully aware, that can be a dangerous assumption. It is highly unlikely the dealer checked for more than the basics before selling the car, and it is doubtful the service records were ever reviewed in detail.

As stated in the Mitsu training video, the carbon buildup from infrequent oil changes is what they will officially acknowledge as contributing to timing chain stretch. They won't admit to the design flaw, but the chain was revised for a reason.

That said, do you have a Mitsu extended warranty, or one with a 3rd party?

Also, if there is a different, more competent dealer in your area, you may want to have the car taken there on a flatbed for a 2nd opinion.
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Old 01-23-2013, 02:35 PM
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MTZL MTZL is offline
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Welcome to my world. Dealership are useless incompetent money stealing buffoons.

At capitol mitsubishi stealership in san jose, ca.
Me: how much is the timing chain replacement
SM: you don't replace the timing chain.
Me: I may have stretched timing chain.
SM: we don't replace timing chain.
Me: ? Why not
SM: we replace the whole motor.
Me: I cannot afford to change the motor.
SM: timing chain is good for the whole lifetime.
Me: ok so why is it part of 60k service?
SM: just drive it til the motor gives out.
Me: smh...

They just charged the corporate x amount of $ to delete the SES (Service Engine Soon) P0016 code.
I could have done this for 0$.

And they called it completed.
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Last edited by MTZL; 01-23-2013 at 02:38 PM.
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Old 01-23-2013, 06:49 PM
deprydation deprydation is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTZL View Post
Welcome to my world. Dealership are useless incompetent money stealing buffoons.

At capitol mitsubishi stealership in san jose, ca.
Me: how much is the timing chain replacement
SM: you don't replace the timing chain.
Me: I may have stretched timing chain.
SM: we don't replace timing chain.
Me: ? Why not
SM: we replace the whole motor.
Me: I cannot afford to change the motor.
SM: timing chain is good for the whole lifetime.
Me: ok so why is it part of 60k service?
SM: just drive it til the motor gives out.
Me: smh...

They just charged the corporate x amount of $ to delete the SES (Service Engine Soon) P0016 code.
I could have done this for 0$.

And they called it completed.

I would have asked for that to be documented and signed by the SM of the dealership. That way when your engine goes out you can go straight to MMNA in Cypress and have your engine replaced and that dude fired for being a fktard.
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